On the “Prewrath Rapture View” Facebook page, a person named John Williams took issue with my recent blog post that prewrath has defining tenets.  His objection continues to add confusion (to an already-confused area of theology) by supporting the hybrid nomenclature of “prewrath-posttrib” or “postrib-prewrath.”

I want to reply to him. Here is an excerpt of what he mostly wrote:

“I think this is something Kurschner needs challenging on by people within the same prewrath fold as him. It’s arbitrary and sets his own list up as the authority of what is and is not “prewrath,” and then refuses to acknowledge others who hold to the same rapture view as him in regard to timing, but differ on some details that do not specifically affect timing. Yes, the prewrath view is inherently as ‘post tribulational’ because it places the rapture after the tribulation. This is not contradictory as AK claimed. Anyone who holds to a view that splits to tribulation from the day of the Lord, making one man’s or Satans wrath and the latter Gods wrath, with a rapture inbetween, is prewrath, whether or not they tick all of AKs boxes. I get why he does it, because he doesn’t want to associate with hateful men like Steven Anderson. Or others like Prasch. But if the shoe fits. The same is true for pre trib. There is a wide variety of differences over smaller details in the pre trib camp. 

i. He claims that I am “arbitrary” and “sets his own list up as the authority of what is and is not prewrath.” Not only does he give zero evidence for this, but it could not be further from the truth. I have been teaching prewrath for 30 years and arguably may have read more prewrath literature than anyone else. I think that gives me some credibility as a starter on suggesting a list of defining essentials for prewrath!

ii. Contrary to John Williams ignorant claim that my “Tenets of Prewrath” list is arbitrary, a lot of hard work and thought went into creating this list. Further, it is not “my list.” It is a descriptive list, not a prescriptive one. I did not pioneer prewrath eschatology. Robert Van Kampen and Marvin Rosenthal pioneered it. The Tenets of Prewrath list reflects the prewrath view that they pioneered.

iii. Williams does not show any familiarity with the list that he critiques. The list is not peripheral beliefs. They are defining essentials. 

iv. To illustrate his confusion. He states, “Yes, the prewrath view is inherently as ‘post tribulational’ because it places the rapture after the tribulation.” He thinks that because prewrath shares this view with posttrib, it justifies the term “prewrath-posttrib.” What he fails to mention is that posttrib and prewrath are distinguishable views. Most posttribs believe that “tribulation” contains God's wrath! So, again, how is that a prewrath view? It is not. Prewrath and posttrib have very different views on the nature of the tribulation. So it is not about the word “tribulation” but how we understand it. Williams equivocates then on that point. Many posttribs place the rapture after God's wrath. In fact, it is pretrib, not posttrib, that agrees with prewrath that the rapture happens before the tribulation of God's wrath. Should we then use the term “pretrib-prewrath”? His logic does not work.

v. Incidentally, not all, but mostly all individuals out there having idiosyncratic views and use the term “postrib-prewrath” believe that the rapture occurs at the seventh trumpet. By definition, that view is not prewrath. It should be called posttrib at the very least.

vi. Williams continues to say, “and then refuses to acknowledge others who hold to the same rapture view as him in regard to timing, but differ on some details that do not specifically affect timing.”  Rapture views are more than “timing.” Just to take one example, if one thinks the trumpet judgments are not God's wrath, you cannot be considered prewrath at all, because by definition prewrath from the beginning has viewed the rapture taking place before the trumpet judgments. In other words, it is not just “timing” that defines a rapture view, but it includes the conception of God's wrath, great tribulation, and their relationships with each other.

vii. Next, Williams makes this false accusation about me: “I get why he does it, because he doesn’t want to associate with hateful men like Steven Anderson. Or others like Prasch. But if the shoe fits.”  I can assure him that he has not received the thousands of emails over the decades of confused Christians wanting to understand the distinctions of rapture views. My motivation is to seek clarity, and when interpreters create idiosyncratic views and appropriate the popular term “prewrath” to their own, it does not help with accuracy or comprehensibility. Call your view something else, but stop muddying definitional prewrath beliefs.

viii. Next, Williams says “There is a wide variety of differences over smaller details in the pre trib camp.” That is not the same as negating the defining big differences of prewrath. Each of the 15 defining tenets of prewrath are core, defining beliefs—not some “small details.” If you deny any of them, then you do not have prewrath in any meaningful sense of the term. If someone, for example, wants to locate the rapture at the seventh trumpet, let them, but don't call it prewrath.

While Williams' critique lacks any meaningful discussion, it allowed me to expand on my previous blog post on the tenets. If you disagree with the tenets of prewrath, more power to them, but come up with another label for your own view.